Tuesday, July 2, 2019

The Order between Jesus and the Father in the Trinity

God is eternal according to the Bible (Gen (1 Mos) 21:33, 1 Chronicles 16:36, 29:10, Nehemiah 9:5, Psalm 10:16, 41:13 (14 in some translations), 90:2, 93:2, 106:48,
Isa 40:28, Rom 16:26). God has always existed and always will exist. God the Father is the source of The Trinity (1 Cor 8:6a). He is neither created nor born, but eternal.

Since Jesus is a person in The Trinityhe can't be a created being as man is and the angels are, he must also be eternal. Jesus is the Son of God, which means that the origin of Jesus when he was born as man on Earth is the Father (Heb 1:3a). 

When the Bible says that Jesus is the firstborn (Col 1:15bRom 8:29, Heb 1:6),
it doesn't mean that Jesus is
God the Father's first creation. In ancient cultures, the firstborn son received a double portion of his father's inheritance. Over the years, the term firstborn in the Bible began not so much to mean the first in birth, but began to speak about preeminence and importance. It started to become a quality word. It's used in the Bible where it doesn't literally speak of a firstborn child, but of first in rank. An example is when God calls David firstborn, meaning the highest of the kings on Earth (Psalm 89:20, 27 (21, 28 in some translations)). God even calls Israel his firstborn son (Exo (2 Mos) 4:22–23). This is how the word firstborn is used when speaking of Jesus as the highest in rank. 

Jesus as firstborn also means that he is the first to rise from the dead with a resurrection body (Acts 26:23, Rev 1:5a, Col 1:18, 1 Cor 15:20–23),
see Jesus appeared in his resurrected body in 
The Resurrection of Jesus.

It says: "I will tell of the decree: The Lord said to me, 'You are my Sontoday
I have begotten you.
'
" (Psalm 2:7, Acts 13:32–33, Heb 1:4–6). It's Jesus who quotes God the Father in Psalm 2:7. The decree is that Jesus is the Son of God
and that he was begotten on a specific day (2 Sam 7:14a). This means that Jesus became the begotten of the Father at a point in time. Before that, Jesus was the Word: "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." (John 1:1). The Bible says about Jesus: "And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us." (John 1:14a). It was at a point in time when the Holy Spirit moved upon Mary and she conceived through him, and gave birth to Jesus Christ. The word begotten refers only to the incarnation.  See General in The Book of Hebrews.

If you compare the Father with the sun, then Jesus is the rays of light that come from the sun. The sun produces the light rays, which have been around as long as the sun. Just as the Father is eternal, Jesus is eternal, and the origin of Jesus is the Father. If compare a river to the Father, then the streams of water are Jesus. The river produces the currents of water, which have existed as long as the river
has existed.


A distinction can be made between the following:
  1. Nature
  2. Personal characteristics
  3. Order
Jesus belongs to the same divine nature as God the Fatherwhich means that he doesn't have a lower divine nature than the Father has (Phil 2:5–8). You can compare it to the fact that all people, women and men, belong to the same human nature, that is, all people are on the same level of nature, according to God.

The Father and Jesus have different personal characteristics, they are different
persons in the Godhead. For example, the Father gave birth to Jesus. It doesn't
mean that Jesus is less divine than the Father, they have the same divine nature.
The Father couldn't be born as a man on Earth and die on the cross, because the
Father is the original source not only of the universe but of The Trinity. Only 
Jesus could do that. Thus, the Father is different from Jesus if you look at personal attributes, but not if you look at nature (deity). The first people on Earth,
Adam and 
Eve, were similar in nature as humans, but had different personal characteristics. Eve's origin was Adam, she had been created from Adam's rib
Eve could bear children, something Adam couldn't.

The Father is greater than Jesus if you look at order. It can be compared to
Adam who was created before Eve and has the main responsibility for
family (1 Cor 11:3). The Father has authority over Jesus. Jesus makes the will
of 
the Father and sits on the right side of the Father. The fact that there is an
order of authority between the Father and Jesus doesn't mean that the divinity
of 
Jesus is lower than that the Father's. The fact that the man has the main
responsibility in the family doesn't mean that the woman has a lower human
dignity than the man. Nations often have people in leading positions of authority,
companies have people in leading positions of authority, this for nations and
companies to work better. It doesn't mean that they have a greater human
dignity before God than other people. Likewise, there is an order in the Godhead

Jesus experienced subordination to God the Father when he lived as a man on Earth, even though he was, and still is, fully God eternally. Jesus will always be in that position forever. Jesus as God the Son will be subordinated God the Father forever. (1 Cor 15:24–28). It doesn't mean that Jesus will be inferior to God the Father.
It's a choice of will.

When God is mentioned in the New Testament, it's usually the Father that is meant.
But John 1:1 mentions Jesus as God. What is meant here is that Jesus was
with God the Father and that Jesus has the same divine nature as the Father.

The following Bible verses show the deity of Jesus, that Jesus has the same divine nature as God the Father, see the Definition of the Trinity in The Trinity.
Differences in personal attributes and order between the Father and the Son:
  • Mark 13:32 :
    The Father has knowledge about things that Jesus doesn't.
  • John 1:18, Exo (2 Mos) 33:20 : No one has seen the Father.
  • John 5:19–20, 6:38, 8:28–29, 12:49–50, 14:31a : Jesus does the will of the Father, see time 4:42–6:12 in John 5:19-47 – Opposed by Unbelief.
  • Col 1:15a, Heb 1:3a, John 14:9 : Jesus is the image of the Father.
    It means that Jesus is the person of God that we can see, the representation of God to mortal eyes. But he is more than a representation, he is the exact likeness. See time 8:42–11:50 in 
    John 5:19-47 – Opposed by Unbelief.
  • Heb 1:1–9, John 20:17 : The Father is the God of Jesus.
    Jesus has received his authority from the Father ⑴.
  • John 14:28b, Mat 20:23 : The Father is greater than Jesus.
  • Acts 3:13a, 4:27a : Jesus sees himself as a servant, see
    Who is the Greatest in the Kingdom of Heaven?
  • 1 Cor 11:3, 15:24–28 : Jesus submits to the Father.
⑴ That Jesus refers to the Father as his God has to do with the order between the Father and Jesus. Jesus and the Father are of the same divine nature.

See the hierarchy in The Trinity explained at time 24:25–26:08 in
Bible Q&A with Pastor Paul │February 2024.


See also Some stories in the gospels at the end of The Four Gospels.